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SUBSCRIPTIONS WILL NEED TO BE RENEWED IN JANUARY, 2006 - SEE
NOTE TO SUBSCRIBERS AT THE END OF THIS LETTER
I have defied Death four times that I know of in the
last three months so I must not have fulfilled my destiny at this point.
I cannot explain why I have more lives than the average cat except it
may be because I was conceived under the 'ANGEL OAK'
Since I apparently am going to be around for awhile longer I need to
apologize to several thousand subscribers and one non-subscriber.
When you get older but not necessarily wiser, medical issues
become part of your life. To explain what was happening and why you haven't
received any newsletters recently, here it is: It started when I
got a 'pulmonary embolism' (which most people don't survive) and
in my case related to the taking of a particular
medication and Post Polio Syndrome. The pictured creature
not from War of the Worlds but is actually a Greenfield filter
installed in a primary vein to catch blood clots. I had two additional
clots (Deep Vein Thrombosis) since the PE which caught me off guard - one in
each leg that has prevented me from walking on crutches as I have for 50 years.
The pain, I am told and believe, is equalivent to that suffered by cancer
patients so I didn't much feel up to writing newsletters. I appreciate all
of your patience and know that I am now feeling terrific, and look forward to
hearing from you all. It has been a grateful Thanksgiving with much to be
NOTE: This newsletter IS published
once a month with a
to the online addition available to subscribers only. ALL
issues are dedicated not only to the brave
honorable Men of the Hunley,
but also to the Subscribers
Contributors to each issue, particularly to
CSS H L HUNLEY CLUB.This is my tenth year of running the Hunley.com website as a
free service to all those that played a part in making this happen.
George W. Penington
2)William Blackmore Announces: A NEW HUNLEY
Finally we are allowed to announce that the final touches are being put on
the most complete and correct 1/24 scale Cutaway model of the CSS H
model is 27.5 inches long and features the interior mechanics actually
found in the Hunley including such things as the bellows, depth gage, the
bench and the bilge pump.
(Click poster to enlarge)
William Blackmore's model assimilates the spar support
arrangement found on Mike Crisafulli's poster available
aft bilge pump can be mounted at 45 degree angle or straight up and down.
The hatches, flywheel and other essential mechanics are all cast. There
are over one hundred parts including approximately ½ lb. of metal - making
this model the most complex Hunley model on the market. This model kit is
for the experienced modeler able to be creative, imaginative and
patient. The limited space in the cabin makes for a very crowded condition
just as it was in real life.
Blackmore stated in an interview last week that he has gone with the four
cable set-up apparatus for controlling the spar and torpedo. (As rendered
Crisafulli's Reconstruction site and the
Rugoff-Darrow site with illustrations by Bruce Kinney. He also stated
that he is definitive on the issue that the torpedo was electronically
detonated an issue discussed further in this newsletter. Blackmore is
sending me the model to build so that I can make a historical record of
the progress of putting it together. This model will separate the men from
the boys and we shall see which category I fall into.
these models are technically not ready and limited by the first molding
the Hunley Store has decided that they be reserved to give away as
Christmas presents with the purchase of a $10.00 gift certificate.
Hunley Store is offering this replica of a Confederate Ten Dollar bill as
proof of reservation that can be held or given away as a Christmas present
reserving one of the first of this series to be shipped sometime in
The bearer of this
numbered Confederate Ten Dollar Bill #____________will be reserved one
newly released and updated 27.5” Cutaway CSS H L Hunley. The grantor
of this note agrees to pay the balance of One Hundred Eighty-nine
dollars prior to the shipping date projected to be in February, 2006,
One hundred forty-two years after she sank the USS Housatonic and
finally returned to port in the year 2000.
Signed by the Hunley Store Date
Singer torpedo attached to the end of a 20' spar adapted to be
by George W. Penington
CHARLESTON - .Hunley researchers have presented us
with a new mystery. Could the CSS H L Hunley have used a battery powered
torpedo to set off its explosive force after it was attached to the hull
of the Housatonic.
Researchers have uncovered a number of items that forward the issue of
battery power. For example out of the sludge comes a rectangular copper
plate and coils of wire, the kind of stuff used to build a battery
according to Mike Drews, a
professor at Clemson University. The rectangular plate had holes drilled
in it and traces of zinc remained attached. Even though this
material can not be described as defining it raises the mystery bar.
Drews stated that "several parts of any onboard battery, such as zinc
plates, would have disintegrated over time, along with paper or cloth
separating the plates."
According to Paul Mardikian, the sub's senior
conservator. "It is not enough to say there was an electrical system on
the Hunley, but we cannot rule it out" but most researchers believe the
Hunley was experimenting with the new battery technology.
The copper-and-zinc plate, a coil of wire and a
single separate strand of wire with a noose on the end which was
possibly the trigger wire was found in Lt. George Dixon's command post
in the most forward position of the sub.
In 1863 and earlier the North and the South was
experimenting with electronics.
The reader may recall that the Union Navy's
version of the submarine, the Alligator, was designed to release divers
underwater to set electrically detonated charges to the hull of
After the Hunley sank the USS Housatonic off
Sullivan's Island on Feb. 17, Confederates used electric
torpedoes to sink a Union ship in the James River in August 1864
the same year.
All along we have thought that he Hunley's torpedo
was triggered by a rope lanyard and that the torpedo exploded mistakenly
early. Remember that
during the excavation of the
aft ballast tank, scientists discovered a coil of rope. The fragile
textile and waterlogged rope was carefully removed for conservation and
At this time we have not heard further evidence of its make-up or type
of material used.
We all believe that a forward thinking intelligent
commander would have researched and prepared for alternative methods of
sinking his enemy, after all this may have been their only chance.
"We had two pumps and deadlights reinforcing the glass ports along the
top of the submarine," said Sen. Glenn McConnell, chairman of the Hunley
Commission. "If the torpedo could also have been electrically detonated,
this would be right in line with the Hunley to have fail-safe measures
in place for all her critical functions. This would be a cutting-edge
upgrade to an already state-of-the-art firing system."
Still, some think the wire could have been used as the lanyard
trigger because wire would be less likely to tangle and would be
harder for the enemy to see. It is apparent that 150 feet plus of 1/4
rope would have taken a larger spool than the one pictured on the
starboard side of the Hunley.
Note the size of the spool in this Cook photo.
Clemson University using CSI tactics is bound to get to the bottom of
Lying among the tools, ballast and spare parts
littering the floor of the Hunley, the rectangular copper plate
looked like something from a UFO.
Drilled with holes, lined with symmetrical
ridges and laced with traces of zinc, the plate at first raised
more questions than it answered about the Confederate submarine.
But put it together with strange coils of wire
and other things found onboard, and the plate suggests the crew
might have used a battery-powered torpedo to sink the
"It's the kind of thing if I were trying to
build a battery in the 1860s that I would have used," Mike
Drews, a material science professor at Clemson University, said.
"Having a piece of copper sheeting by itself isn't that strange,
but this piece doesn't look like what you'd expect."
Clemson is expected to begin an analysis of
the plate next week to see what else scientists can learn. The
clues that Hunley scientists have gathered so far hint that the
sub was experimenting with battery technology. For starters, the
artifact looks similar to the copper and zinc plates used to
build batteries in those days. It was found in the captain's
compartment, where commander George Dixon was in charge of the
torpedo. It was within an arm's reach of a coil of wire and also
a twisted wire with a noose on the end that could have served as
a trigger. There doesn't appear to be wire used on any other
part of the sub.
While all this evidence is circumstantial, it
is promising nonetheless. It means that the Hunley may have been
not only the first sub to sink an enemy ship, but the first ship
of any kind to sink a ship using battery-powered weapons.
"It is not enough to say there was an
electrical system on the Hunley, but we cannot rule it out,"
said Paul Mardikian, the sub's senior conservator.
Although the Hunley's predecessor, the
American Diver, was briefly fitted with an electro-magnetic
engine, there is little chance a battery -- if onboard -- had
any other use than weaponry. And, by the time the Hunley was
launched, electrically detonated mines were the cutting edge of
Confederates allegedly sank the USS Cairo with
the first electric mine, which was attached by wire to the
shore. The Union Navy's submarine, the Alligator, was meant to
take divers underwater to plant electrically detonated charges
beneath enemy ships, but it was lost before it ever saw action.
In August 1864 -- more than six months after the Hunley sank the
Housatonic off Sullivan's Island on Feb. 17 of that year --
Confederates used electric torpedoes to sink a Union ship in the
The technology took off after the war. In the
late 1860s, the British Navy began experimenting with electric
torpedoes, but did not perfect the system until the 1870s.
Until now, most scientists have speculated the
Hunley's spar-mounted torpedo was triggered by a rope lanyard
that through friction or some other means detonated the 90-pound
charge of gunpowder in the torpedo. That still may be the case.
It could be that the sub was merely experimenting with battery
detonators, or used both methods. Hunley research has shown,
time and again, that the crew was prepared for Plan B.
"We had two pumps and deadlights reinforcing
the glass ports along the top of the submarine," said Sen. Glenn
McConnell, chairman of the Hunley Commission. "If the torpedo
could also have been electrically detonated, this would be right
in line with the Hunley to have fail-safe measures in place for
all her critical functions. This would be a cutting-edge upgrade
to an already state-of-the-art firing system."
Another, yet related, explanation for the wire
onboard the sub also concerns the spar, the pole attached to the
front of the sub. The lanyard used to trigger the spar may have
been wire instead of rope. Wire would have been more
hydrodynamic, less likely to tangle, and nearly invisible.
And the spool mounted on the sub, as depicted
in contemporary art, was not nearly big enough to hold hundreds
of feet of rope. But it could have handled that much wire
That, however, does not explain why the crew
would have had a battery onboard.
The absence of other material is pretty easy
to explain. Drews said zinc plates would have disintegrated --
that was their job in a battery -- and the paper or cloth
separating the plates could have rotted, as well. If traces of
such things remain, Clemson scientists should find them in their
Although it's tempting to envision an innovative
battery sandwich of
copper, tin, and cloth in the cabin next to Dixon, I'm skeptical. I've done
only a little checking on historical battery technology, but it appears that
Gassner's 1880s invention was the first successful dry cell. Leclanche was
experimenting with improved batteries in the late 1860s and perfected one that
could be mass manufactured for telegraph use. Some credit him with developing
the dry cell - one type of dry cell is called a Leclanche Cell - but it appears
that any battery in the Hunley would have used a liquid electrolyte. So if the
copper plate was part of a battery, I'd expect the remains of a fairly large
liquid-tight container to be found as well.
I think it's more likely, as Brian Hicks suggests, that the loose wire coil
found hanging in the tank is evidence that thin wire was used as the mechanical
torpedo lanyard instead of rope.
******************* MORE ON BATTERIES
Beginning his work in 1794, Italian inventor Alessandro Volta observed the
electrical interaction between two different metals submerged near each other in
an acidic solution. Based on this principle, his first battery consisted of a
series of alternating copper and zinc rings in an acid solution known as an
electrolyte. His device for generating a consistent flow of electricity was
invented in 1800. He called his invention a column battery, although it came to
be commonly known as the Volta battery, Voltaic cell or Voltaic pile. Volta’s
discovery of a means of converting chemical energy into electrical energy formed
the basis for nearly all modern batteries. Volta researched the effects which
different metals produced when exposed to salt water. In 1801, Volta
demonstrated the Voltaic cell to Napoleon Bonaparte (who later ennobled him,
Count, for his discoveries). http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventions/story066.htm
Alessandro Volta invented the voltaic pile and discovered the first
practical method of generating electricity. Constructed of alternating discs
of zinc and copper with pieces of cardboard soaked in brine between the
metals, the voltic pile produced electrical current. The metallic conducting
arc was used to carry the electricity over a greater distance. Alessandro
Volta's voltaic pile was the first "wet cell battery" that produced a
reliable, steady current of electricity.
1836 - Englishman, John F. Daniel invented the Daniel Cell that used two
electrolytes: copper sulfate and zinc sulfate. The Daniel Cell was somewhat
safer and less corrosive then the Volta cell.
1839 - William Robert Grove developed the first
which produced electrical by combining hydrogen and oxygen.
1839 to 1842 - Inventors created improvements to batteries that used
liquid electrodes to produce electricity. Bunsen (1842) and Grove (1839)
invented the most successful.
1859 - French inventor, Gaston Plante developed the first practical
storage lead-acid battery that could be recharged (secondary battery). This
type of battery is primarily used in cars today.
4)FACTS THAT MAY HAVE MADE POSSIBLE ELECTRONIC TORPEDO
DETONATION CAPABILITY IN THE CSS H L HUNLEY
The Federals didn't like our Southern
presents we left them in our rivers and harbors. The torpedoes were often
described as: "Diabolical Warfare", "Infernal Machines" and "little sea devils"
Here are some of the facts and players that
led us and helped develop the potential to use an electronically fired torpedo
mounted to the end of a spar on the south's most modern and top secret
submarine. Individuals who may have the most influence on this type of torpedo
development were Mathew F. Maury, Samuel Colt, and possibly Robert Fulton to
name a few.
the CSS H L Hunley had electronic torpedo detonation capability then the Confederate States
Navy Submarine Battery Service, Confederate States Army Torpedo Bureau and
Confederate States Secret Service, that were all established during the Civil War, contributed to the advancement of this Torpedo
capability. During October, 1862
the Confederate Torpedo Bureau was established under Lieutenant H. Davidson,
continuing the work pioneered by Commander M. F. Maury.
Matthew F. Maury Nicknamed "Pathfinder of the Seas," with
the approval of the Confederate government, began immediately experimenting and
working on an electric torpedo design during the American Civil War. His
initial attempts were fruitful and his work tended to be primarily with
electricity. He drew several Confederate naval officers (mostly former US Navy
officers who had served with him) to the torpedo ranks on a full-time or
Maury, an underwater explosives researcher, resigned from the U.S. Navy and
offered his services to the Richmond government in 1861, eventually forming the
Submarine Battery Service to construct and employ electrically-activated
mines. source: http://www.exwar.org/Htm/8000PopH3.htm
Diagram of electrically detonated
“torpedo” of the type used by Confederate forces during the U.S. Civil War. This
diagram resembles the shape of the previously assumed Singer Torpedo.
The ironclad Cairo was the first major U.S. Navy ship
lost to mine in the Civil War. Operating in the Yazoo River in Mississippi
in December 1862, Cairo was destroyed by a mine triggered by a nearby
Confederate shore party as she attempted to support mine-spotting boats
moving on the river in front of her.
Besides firearms, other roles Colt played in the development
included the first remotely detonated
the first underwater
cable, and the popularization of
nitrous oxide as
In 1842 Sam Colt then turned his attention to selling the
U.S. government on
his ideas for waterproof ammunition;
underwater mines for harbor defense; and,
with the inventor Samuel F. B. Morse, the telegraph.
In 1844, Colt demonstrated
for Congress his invention
of an underwater mine that used a telegraphed signal
for harbor defense. Colt’s showmanship prevailed as
he blew up a 500-ton
schooner on the Potomac River
to the delight of the thousands who attended.
to his great disappointment, Colt was once again
unsuccessful in securing a U.S.
After a couple of decades, Samuel Colt, firearms
tried his hand at the torpedo business. He admittedly
off of Fulton's efforts. By 1841, he had
developed some rudimentary torpedoes
fired by electricity,
developed significantly since Fulton's time.
Colt managed a couple of demonstrations during
blowing up ships with electrically detonated mines.
impressed and voted him a considerable
sum of money to continue his efforts.
He had experience in firearms, explosives, ships,
sea, and so he used his experience and
imagination to develop a device that
could set off
an underwater explosive by remote control..
The following is excerpted from the Northern
Admiral D. D.
Porters writings about Torpedo Warfare.
Torpedo Warfare. [The North American review. /
Issue 264, September - October 1878]
Part 2 AUTHOR Admiral D. D. Porter, U.S. Navy
Page images are mounted
at Cornell University Library.
This text was generated from the page images by optical character
recognition (OCR). Corrections have been applied by George W. Penington
In the early 19th Century Robert Fulton [FULTON, Robert,
born in Little Britain township (now Fulton), Lancaster County,
Pennsylvania, in 1765;
died in New York, 24 February 1815. ] contemplated the
use of electricity to fire torpedoes,
but abandoned the effort as unfeasible.
He never succeeded in arranging a battery
that would insure ignition of the
fuses.. Fulton's experiments failed and interest waned.
gave up on torpedoes and returned to his successful invention,
despite his prophecy, that the torpedo would finally revolutionize all naval
Fulton was so violently opposed and ridiculed, he was not
much out of the way in advocating a torpedo corps, to consist of a thousand
boats, with their complement of officers and men, to attack the enemy’s vessels
wherever they could be found at anchor or in a calm. In Fulton’s day such a
notion received less encouragement than would now a scheme for transporting
passengers to the Paris Exposition by a balloon. Of late years, so great has
been the progress made in the sciences and mechanic arts that there is no longer
room to question the success of this once dubious system of naval warfare.
All told, we lost nearly twenty vessels from torpedoes during
the war of the rebellion.
The case of the Commodore Jones, a large gunboat
that was blown up at Deep Bottom, on James River, was a particularly painful
one. This vessel was at the time employed in dragging for torpedoes, and
was surrounded by row-boats employed in the same service. The captain having
been notified by a Negro pilot that he was near sunken torpedoes, the gunboats
engines were stopped and she commenced backing. Scarcely had she gathered
stern-way, when suddenly and without any apparent cause she appeared to be
lifted bodily, her wheels rapidly revolving in the air, and persons declared
they could see the green grass of the river-bank beneath her keel. An immense
fountain of foaming water shot to a great height, followed by a denser column
thick with mud. The vessel absolutely crumbled to pieces, dissolved as it were
in mid-air, enveloped by the falling spray, mud, water, and smoke. When the
excitement of the explosion subsided, not a vestige of the vessel remained in
except small fragments of her frame which came shooting to the surface. Nearly
every one on board was killed or wounded. This vessel was destroyed by a
charge of about two thousand pounds of powder contained in a tank and fired by
electric wires. It is needless to say that this catastrophe checked the
of the other vessels astern of the Jones, but measures were immediately
taken to capture the torpedo-operators, who, to save their lives, pointed out
the location of other infernal machines, and explained the secrets of their
[Note: The Confederates would hide on the shore line after
anchoring their torpedoes in the river channel and running several hundred feet
of wire to a triggering mechanism]
The Confederates took particular pains to defend the James River by torpedoes,
which had the effect of completely closing it against the approach of the United
States vessels. Our fleet would have been destroyed in detail had it attempted
to force its way up against the concealed torpedoes protected by heavy
batteries. In the early part of 1864 the Confederates had completed their system
of defense throughout the South, and the difficulty of approaching their
strongholds through their lines of torpedoes was almost insurmountable. The
ideas of Fulton seemed to have taken possession of our humane friends at
the South, and it would require a book to describe all the incidents connected
with Confederate torpedo warfare, and to recite the damage we sustained
in the latter part of the war, when the enemy had by means of blockade-runners
imported hundreds of electric batteries, and tons of iron carcasses to be
filled and distributed, as occasion required, through all parts of the
Confederacy. Every navigable stream within their jurisdiction was amply defended
by submarine batteries; and General Beauregard remarked concerning
Charleston, that he attached more importance to one of his pet torpedoes for
the defense of that place than to five ten-inch guns; and well he might, since
our iron-clads were impervious to the latter, and entirely vulnerable to the
The following is a list of our vessels destroyed or severely damaged after the
Confederates had succeeded in getting their torpedo system in full operation.
Some of the saddest episodes of the war were in connection with the loss of
these vessels Cairo, Baron de Kalb, Eastport, a wharf-boat, Commodore
Jones, Tecumseh, Otsego, Basely, Patapsco, Harvest Moon, Milwaukee, Osage,
Rodolphe, Scioto, Ida, Althea, Housatonic to say nothing of
injuries to vessels, destruction of boats, and a somewhat demoralizing effect
temporarily produced on a navy which has never yet declined to attempt the most
5) SPAR UPDATE
Mike (the Torpedo Man) Kochan aka "evilmike2"
Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 15:55:44 -0000
Subject: [CSS H L HUNLEY] SPAR UPDATE
this up at Hyberina park this weekend for the first time at an event and
it was well received by all. I had a better spot than last year. The
weather wasn't great and it's shake down cruise turned up some things that
need fine tuning.
The full size, U. S. Iron Clad Steamer Monitor turret canopy was
recognized from a distance by quite a few, not like the case with the
Torpedoes where very few people knew about them. Now I have to do some
more homework on the Monitor.
Mike. Sun, 28 Aug 2005
I've built a full size awning and stanchions repro of the Monitor's
Turret cover. So I've been digging for Monitor facts lately.
I was able to get enough Info and x-rays from Paul and Maria at the
Lasch Center this spring to build the yoke and spar and set up at a
living History mid July.
As well as working with Bill McGrath for his new Hunley attack print
that came out June or July. Check his web site for his Torpedo set up. [Note:
McGrath's website is apparently down for repairs]
Basically from the 1 inch dia yoke bolt to the 1 3/4 long slot at the
other end of the spar is 16 feet. The first section of the 3 piece spar
is a solid bar 44 inches long from the yoke bolt to the end and
back from the end 2 inches is a hole for a bolt to fasten it the next
section. That section is 67 inches long and also has a bolt hole in it
almost 4 inches from the end allowing the yoke bar it enter aprox. 6
inches. the aprox 1/2 inch dia bolt that goes thru these holes in a
virt. position sticks out about an inch and a half on both sides of
the spar itself and had the head and nut on the ends meaning something
could have been fastened there but is not there now. For something involved
with lowering to the proper depth the attachment here at 42
inches from the yoke pivot bolt has to be thought out more.
The third piece joins the second with about a 3 1/2 inch dia. coupling 3
inches long this as well as the spar tube are really close to today's
2 inch sched. 40 pipe ( about 2 1/2 O.D. with a 1/4 inch wall
From the info I have there are no bolts here so they no
doubt threaded together. The third section is 81 inches from it's end
to the center of the lengthwise slot with a bolt in it. the bolt has
it's head and nut leaving about a half inch space between them and the
spar tube dia. then another 6 inches or so to the very end which might
have been broken off.
Around the slot area is a lead wrap about 1/16 0r so thick . This lead
was probably pored into the space between the spar O.D. and the
Torpedo tank thimble I.D. which had an open slot in the end several
inches long to hold the bolt. The bolt was not tightened down but was
to prevent side to side swinging of the tank. The lead sleeve held the
torpedo to the spar but on impact with the hull it allowed a good 3
inches of movement loosening the joint and allowing the spar to pull
out of the thimble as the sub backed away. The spar being in pieces
and the thimble straps for the tank removal would allow it to be taken
to a forge where the lead could be pored in then taken back to the sub
I used Singer's drawings for the tank and trigger box for the Torpedo
which places the triggers in front of the tank so I made the tank
thimble with a holder on the barb end which allowed the barb to enter
the hull but would stop entering at the holder leaving the front of
the tank about 6 inches from the hull. You need the tank as close as
possible to get the desired effect.
A test was done back then using a thin skin tank (not boiler plate)
containing 150 pounds of black powder. It was lowered 10 feet under
water and positioned 2 feet from a ship's hull. When detonated it did
not damage the hull. This means the force went to the path of least
resistance and broke the surface and didn't build up enough force to
break open the hull.
This could very well mean that once the Housatonic's hull opened up at
about (guess) 7 foot depth any other damaging force would have broken
the surface and not come back to where the Hunley was when she was 18
feet away when she stuck the torpedo in. So if she were at 50 feet
away when it was detonated she would feel a ripple force but not a
damaging force. NOTE: THESE COMMENTS ARE THEORY BUSTERS AND WILL BE
FURTHER DISCUSSED IN FUTURE NEWSLETTERS - GWP
With the heavy wall pipe and the 1 inch bolt and the bearing surface
around it it's quite possible they didn't need any other support to
drop her down close to the ship and stick her in the side.
They shipped and unshipped the tank and the fact that no wench was
found I feel means that these operations were done at the dock and or
with a small boat and the spar was designed to be released to depth
and not raised and lowered at will by the sub.
Enough for a while.
Barry Rogoff <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote: No
one knows the actual spar configuration and it's likely that no one ever
will. There was only one month between the point at which Dixon converted
the boat to a spar torpedo and the final mission so it's likely that the
spar configuration was built to be as simple
and foolproof as possible. The concept was based on the original David (the
one that attacked the New Ironsides) but had two major differences:
1. It used a single pivot point instead of a Y-shaped spar with two
pivot points on opposite sides of the hull.
2. The torpedo detached from the spar and was detonated remotely
instead of on impact.
Also, search eBay for hunley -(con,randy,leann) for recent models.
There are two issues on which there are different schools of thought:
1. Were the spar and torpedo fixed at departure time or deployed
(lowered into position) when lined up for the attack run?
2. If the spar and torpedo were fixed, what sort of lateral support
was used to overcome water resistance when the Hunley changed
From:"david coon" Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 20:38:30 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:Re: [CSS H L HUNLEY] Re: Hunley's Spar?
I believe that you hit the nail right on the
head with your comments about the need for simplicity in the Hunley's
torpedo spar arrangement. I'd say that the final spar arrangement probably
consisted of the iron spar that was found, a support cable to the upper bow
point, and two lateral bracing cables running to the lugs underneath the
diving planes. The only justification for the additional weight and
complexity of a hoisting spar would be to avoid blowing up on a floating
log. The fact that Dixon and Alexander planned to ram their
torpedo into the side of an enemy ship at full speed tells me that they were
confident that it wouldn't detonate until they were ready for it to.
Also, if I were on the Hunley, I wouldn't bet my life on her ability to
handle the extra top weight when the torpedo was hoisted up out of the
water. So I'd bet on the idea that the spar was fixed at departure time.
Live Long and Prosper. David Coon
Thanks David. I'm not taking a position on
the fixed vs. deployable
spar question. I think either was possible. I just want to clarify
the facts a bit.
<<The only justification for the additional weight and complexity of
a hoisting spar would be to avoid blowing up on a floating log.>>
Hitting floating debris would not have detonated the torpedo because
it didn't have an impact fuse. Ramming the harpoon point into a
floating log, however, might have been somewhat problematic.
Running with a raised spar would have increased maneuverability and
kept the torpedo relatively dry. The actual fuse was connected to a
lanyard and may not have been perfectly watertight. EvilMike, care
<<The fact that Dixon and Alexander planned to ram their torpedo
into the side of an enemy ship at full speed...>>
They didn't. The mass of the Hunley was great enough to have
destroyed the spar or rammed it right through the hull of the
Housatonic. They wanted to hit just hard enough to firmly plant the
harpoon point and may have been slowing down at the point of impact.
<<...I wouldn't bet my life on her ability to handle the extra
top weight when the torpedo was hoisted up out of the water.>>
Compared to the actual weight of the boat (about 7.5 tons), I don't
think raising the torpedo would have made much of a difference.
Dixon had two ways to adjust the trim: pumping water into and out of
the ballast tanks, and pumping water between the two.
discovered Hunley's lost snorkels
- Back in Time to July 2000
1. Support straps: On Saturday evening,
divers had excavated the bow section and installed 6 of the straps. Foam padding
is added to each strap to cushion the sub. A total of 32 slings will cradle the
2. Snorkels: the divers discovered the
missing snorkels. Source: National Park Service, Naval Historical Center, S.C.
Institute of Archaeology and Anthropology, Oceaneering International Inc.
"Dr. Bob Neyland, Hunley project manager,
said the two snorkels were found on the ocean floor on the sub's starboard side.
The longer of the two pieces is about 1.5 meters - or 4 feet - long. The snorkel
set was one of the last missing pieces of the submarine."
"This sub is getting more and more
complete," Neyland said. "The fact that the snorkels were right there shows that
the sub hasn't moved much."
"That the sub is probably lying almost
exactly where it came to rest in 1864 is good news both for the sub's condition
and any artifacts that may be inside the lost sub."
William Alexander, a lieutenant in the
Confederate army and a one-time Hunley crew member, in a 1902 article suggested
the sub's snorkel assembly didn't work very well. Alexander, who was reassigned
before the Hunley's last mission, wrote that more often than not, the sub would
just surface and they'd open a hatch to get more air."
According to Hunley historian Mark Ragan's
book "The Hunley: Submarines, Sacrifice and Success in the Civil War," the idea
was that the submarine would rise to just beneath the surface; the air shafts
(snorkels) would be raised to filter in good air."
"In 1995, diver Ralph Wilbanks - a member of the Clive Cussler dive team that found the sub -
reported the snorkel assembly was in the up position, but the breathing tubes
had broken off. Wilbanks was one of the divers in the water Saturday when the
snorkels were found, helping Neyland with a fiberglass tape profile of the
Archaeologists examine snorkels from the sunken Hunley
submarine. Aboard the barge transporting the H.L. Hunley back to
Charleston, two team members examine the snorkels from the
Hello to all the members on this site,(CSS H L HUNLEY CLUB) its really nice to be here
and thanks to the Moderator for the welcoming message.
I am a model maker and run a model kit manufacturing company here in
England called Speedline Models. I have been specializing in the
speed record cars and boats of Donald Campbell and large scale
models of the Royal National Lifeboat Associations Trent and Severn
class of lifeboats for a while now.
Earlier this year I was drawn into the murky subject of working
model submarines, in particular the dive units. I designed a simple
and unique dive unit which we made up and tested and it works very
well. There are loads of model submarines about to put it in but I
thought I might just make one of my own. Looking for an interesting
subject I came across the Hunley. Having researched it via the
amazing web sites that exist on the subject I was hooked. The ship
itself is amazing, the history even more so.
I have a lot of information taken of the web sites and we have
produced a drawing of her at 1/8th scale. Looks about right, a bit
long with the spar on but its the size for me!
I am lucky enough to employ a really fine sculptor who is currently
working on two figures to accompany the model, for display
purposes. The figures are the two in the painting, the guy leaning
on the prop ring and the soldier squatting down. As a display that
should be quite impressive I think?
Speedline is famous in the UK for the high level of detail and
accuracy found on its Lifeboat kits and this model of the Hunley
will be very accurate.
I do not want to go to great lengths and spend lots of money unless
the model is accurate and so here comes the help! bit. The model,
though a fully working, radio controlled model will not compromise
any detail and will be equally at home in the board room, so can
anyone point me in the right direction to get the best possible
drawings/plans and detail reference material for this project?
Authenticity is vital, particularly with such an important subject
and ideally at least two source of the information to enable it to
Your help would be very much appreciated.
Speedline Models. "Adrian Gosling" <email@example.com>
You need to talk to Tim and visit his web site. I build RC subs too
(www.sneill.com) but Tim and David Merriman have both built the Hunley.
Good luck on the project and be sure to visit sub
and post your build so we can all see it and help you.
Hello Adrian -
The Friends of the Hunley have seen fit not to release enough measurements to
make a perfect set of plans so Michael's plans are definitely the best out
there. I suspect when the actual measurements are finally made public, his will
be pretty close to right on. However if you plan to build models for commercial
sale, you will need to work out a licensing arrangement with him.
...Or you could contact The Friends of the Hunley and attempt to work out a deal
with them. If so, I hope you have deep and wide pockets!
My www.RC-Submarines.com site has many photographs of the Hunley taken during
and after its recovery and photos of my 1/12 scale radio controlled model.
Note - with bow planes only and a single central ballast tank, it handles very
poorly as an RC model while under water unless it is run at a VERY slow speed
(close to scale). In reverse it also turns very poorly - surfaced or dived. The
foreplanes only don't allow for precise anglekeeping. I suspect this was handled
on the real sub by pumping and filling the bow and stern tanks to control trim.
A few links follow below , but if you go to www.rc-submarines.com and once you
are in the site, do a Google "Current Site" search, several dozen come up.
Just to say a big thank you to all who have offered their help and
advice in guiding me to the best sources of information on the
Hunley. I think I now have enough to sink a battleship!
Naturally enough, I have been reading with some interest the
thoughts expressed about the circumstances of her sinking and for
what its worth here are my observations of the situation.
Clearly the captain and his crew were in great danger throughout the
mission but at the vital moment, the reactions of the captain must
have been determined by the circumstances at the time and can only
ever remain guessed at. One thing that seems pretty certain to me
is the high possibility of the ballast tanks overflowing, resulting
in all the ballast moving to one end. One thing that model
submariners learn very quickly is that when they go down too
steeply, all the water in the buoyancy tanks floods past the baffle
plates to the bow and the boat dives more steeply. Within seconds
this becomes a vertical one way dive to the bottom.
In a similar manner to the Titanic where a circumstance of the water
flowing over the top of the open watertight bulkheads had not been
considered, the Hunley's design with its open topped ballast tanks is
a serious flaw. Given the circumstances of the night in question,
with a twenty foot long pole stuck into a moving ship, crewmen
moving and the nature of the sea at the time, is it not reasonable
to suggest that the charge was detonated early because the Hunley
was sinking and the crew had little chance of surviving anyway.
Better that than to loose the mission?
"Adrian Gosling" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
I think I can speak for all in saying "you're welcome and good
with your plans."
<<...at the vital moment, the reactions of the captain must have
been determined by the circumstances at the time and can only ever
remain guessed at.>>
That's certainly true. Many people have spent years trying to think
of everything that might have been going through Dixon's mind, but
there was probably something that we've all missed.
<<One thing that seems pretty certain to me is the high possibility
of the ballast tanks overflowing, resulting in all the ballast moving
to one end.>>
The open ballast tanks were clearly a safety hazard. Even the
Friends of the Hunley have acknowledged it. If I remember all the
previous discussions correctly, there were several possible reasons
for that design and one that's fairly certain: it provided a larger
volume of breathable air.
Had the ballast tanks been airtight, they might not have been able
to admit enough water to achieve the slightly positive buoyancy that
is believed to have been standard operating procedure. As it was,
the boat contained metal ballast weights for that exact purpose. And
artifacts (tools?) were found in the forward tank.
<<Given the circumstances of the night in question, with a twenty
foot long pole stuck into a moving ship, crewmen moving and the
nature of the sea at the time, is it not reasonable to suggest that
the charge was detonated early because the Hunley was sinking and
the crew had little chance of surviving anyway. Better that than to
loose the mission?>>
There's no reason to believe that the torpedo didn't detach from the
spar as intended. In fact, there's quite a bit of testimony to prove
that it did. I'm not sure whether or not there was physical evidence
at the business end of the spar.
Although the Housatonic kept up a head of steam and had slipped her
anchors, it's unknown just how much movement she actually achieved
and whether or not it made any difference to the Hunley.
Dixon would have anticipated the change in trim that resulted from
the loss of the mass of the torpedo. He may have used the down angle
to help submerge the boat in order to get some water between her and
the Housatonic's big guns (see recent posts).
And I see no possibility whatsoever that Dixon would have scuttled
the boat without even trying to survive the attack. The Hunley's
mission was dangerous but it wasn't a suicide attack. Men like Dixon
and his crew don't give up their lives that easily.
8)Lee Spence & Harry Peccorelli From
Someone who was there
From: "Mark M. Newell" <email@example.com>
Date:Wed, 7 Sep 2005 09:56:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [CSS H L HUNLEY] Lee Spence & Harry Peccorelli
I have just read Lee Spence's remarks concerning the
discovery of the Hunley and his remarks concerning
Harry Peccorelli. I rarely follow, or respond, to
issues on the Hunley (I can still detect the stink of
the ethics and integrity of some State officials and
Cussler's group in my nostrils), but I would like to
reaffirm Lee Spence's account of the discovery (I did
use his information among that of others in my 20
years of research to confirm that it did actually
still exist and where it was) and also comment on
Harry Peccorelli. Harry was a student when he begged
to be allowed to participate in the 13 day field
project during the summer of 1994. During the search
the groups involved excluded NUMA from detailed
information about the 'targets' we ground truthed
during the field operation. This was done on the
orders of the State because of very specific concerns
about members of the NUMA team. The actual discovery
was made in September of 1994. Cussler and NUMA were
advised of this, again without specific details being
given. Harry Peccorelli subsequently revealed the
actual location to Cussler employees with the result
that they prematurely excavated and tried to claim
'first discovery' in the New York Times. The Times
published a story which credited the entire Hunley
search team (many hundreds of people over 20 years),
sending Cussler into a frenzy of calls to State
officials to get the truth suppressed. Needless to
say, I do not support Lee's conciliatory remarks about
Harry Peccorelli. [Note: Lee's remarks are below - See "Reprint of Spence
Mark M Newell Ph.D., RPA
Augusta Ga. 30903
Articles & Opinion at
Online novel at www.thedaneadventures.blogspot.com
Everything else at
We recommend: www.avoicefromthefront.blogspot.com
Barry Rogoff" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Date:Thu, 08 Sep 2005 15:33:57 -0000
Subject:[CSS H L HUNLEY] Re: Lee Spence & Harry Peccorelli
Thanks very much for posting this information. It confirms what many
of us in the Hunley group have suspected for years.
I'm curious as to exactly which of Lee Spence's remarks you were
addressing. He has participated in this group but it was brief and
took place some time ago. Have there been recent developments in the
ongoing legal conflict over the discovery?
I'd also like to know your opinion about why Dr. Spence's discovery
was never taken seriously by the same groups that jumped at the
opportunity to support Cussler's claim, e.g., politicians,
government agencies, the academic community, and the news media? My
theory is that although Dr. Spence had "the goods" with respect to
the actual location of the Hunley, his presentation wasn't credible
enough to convince anyone that his discovery was real.
I wish I had had the opportunity to shake Sterling Marlin's hand. I have been a
fan of his for years. The first race car driver I ever heard of as a child in
the 1950s was Sterling Moss. So, when Sterling Marlin came along, I paid
attention to his career right from the start. By chance, about six years ago,
while I was on a business trip to London, I happened to meet Sterling Moss and
wife just as they returned from a race and I was invited into their home.
It was a real pleasure. It would have been an honor and a pleasure to have met
Sterling Martin and to have been able to talk with him and tell him about the
Hunley. I think I should have had that opportunity. I did not.
As far as Harry Pecorelli being "the diver, who was the first person to touch
the Hunley," I had published my map showing the Hunley's correct location prior
to Harry's diving on the wreck. And. I think most of the people on this board
are aware of my claim to have first found and touched the Hunley in 1970.
The boat captain the day I found the Hunley was Joe Porcelli who had just gotten
out of the Green Berets. Jim Batey, who then ran a commercial diving business,
and a couple of other people (I believe it was Ron Reneau and Mike Douglas) went
out the next day and/or the day after and dove on it. Joe did likewise. In fact,
I believe Joe actually dove on it twice. Jim and Joe gave signed statements to
that effect years ago. Troy Clanton, III, who was aboard boat the day of find
also gave a signed statement. Unfortunately, Mike and Ron are long deceased. The
next time I went out it was buried. Mike Douglas and David McGeehee helped me
relocated it with a magnetometer, but it was still buried. David signed a
statement about that years ago also. Captain Jack Parker helped me relocate the
Hunley in preparation for my 1980 lawsuit claiming the Hunley. He signed two
statements relative to that. Dr. Mark Newell, who was the official director of
the Hunley Search Project (even according to NUMA), had initiated the project
and has gone on record that he used my maps, which I had furnished to the State
Archaeologist years earlier, and my other data to have the expedition locate the
target in 1994, and which was dug up and proved to be the Hunley in 1995. Dr.
Newell (email@example.com) has stated that he believes I found it first and
that what the 1994/95 Hunley Project did was to "verify" that it was indeed the
I donated my rights to the submarine to the State in 1995, but for well over a
year I didn't visit the Conservation lab because I had been told in front of
witness that I would be arrested if I ever showed up there.
When I finally did go, I was watched as though I was an unwelcome guest or a
threat to the security of the place. When I went up and talked with the man
keeping a close eye on me (who happened to be a man I had always respected), I
was told in no uncertain terms that my presence there was making a lot of people
"uncomfortable." It was a very unpleasant experience for me and my guests. Also,
I did not like the fact that when I paid, I got what I thought was a receipt,
but I had to give it back to them before we could see the sub. I am used to
getting receipts. I paid by check, so that will have to suffice, but avoiding
the obvious accounting issues; I would like to have the receipt or ticket (even
torn in half) as a souvenir.
So, not only have I not gotten the honors I deserve. I have been threatened,
insulted, and humiliated, while others get treatment, privileges and honors that
I believe should have gone to me for my original discovery of the Hunley.
I have no doubt that Harry deserves credit for his work. He does. From what I
have heard he is a very competent and accomplished person. He has unquestionably
been a valuable asset and has helped save the Hunley. I do think he deserves
honors and respect, but I found the Hunley first and I think I deserve
recognition, honors and respect for both my 1970 discovery of the wreck and my
1995 donation of the Hunley to the State.
10)Friends of the Hunley Freedom of
Date:Fri, 04 Nov 2005 14:30:34 -0000
Subject:[CSS H L HUNLEY] Friends of the Hunley Freedom of Information
I think the lawsuit is based on requests for financial information, but
I wonder if the Friend's lawyer agreeing that the organization is
subject to the Freedom of Information Act means we may have access to
technical information that the Friends have been holding so long.
Freedom of Information Act getting little help from the
S.C. Supreme Court even though most parties agree that Friends of the Hunley,
Inc. is a public body.
By George W. Penington
Editor of The Hunley.com Newsletter
Charleston-Friends of the Hunley, Inc. lawyer
Biff Sowell told Associate Justice Costa Pleicones and the five-member
South Carolina Supreme court that" it is my belief that Friends currently is a
public body" and that the FOTH, Inc. must open its records to the public.
The corporation was set up under the states Hunley Commission to handle the
business matters of the recovery and restoration of the American civil war
relic, the Confederate States Submarine H L HUNLEY.
In 2001, Edward Sloan, a Greenville S.C. businessman
filed suit against the FOTH, Inc. requesting financial records and other
documents from the Friends of the Hunley. FOTH, Inc. refused claiming it was a
charitable organization and not subject to the Freedom of Information Act. In an
attempt to avoid further exposure the FOTH, Inc. hurriedly turned over the
In Sloan's law suit Attorney Jim Carpenter said they
were asking the court to declare the Friends of the Hunley, Inc. a public body
and part of the Hunley Commission. This would require the Friends of the Hunley
to conform to state procurement and low-bid procedures, as well as Freedom of
Information. Many individuals and businesses have been shut out of what appears
to be a private club for under the table friends, lawyers, and good ole boys. "
If it is ruled as a public body then it must give information to any citizen
that request it. So far the Friends have given information to reporters,
while denying it to citizens it considers to be harassing it."
Carpenter has expressed the feelings of many of those
on the outside that the group, Friends of the Hunley, Inc., was set up to get
around the limits of government regulations. He said the Friends of the Hunley
has denied FOIA requests to others, including Charleston businessman Jock
Stender, whom Carpenter claimed dug through the Friends of the Hunley trash to
Here lies the conundrum. The case was in appeal
to a lower court when the State Supreme Court without explanation suddenly
decided to hear it. Now Chief Justice Jean Toal has stated that Sloan doesn't
have a case that should be decided by the State Supreme Court. It is still not
clear whether this is the final decision but the judge has stated that the case
was moot, i.e. a dead issue, because Sloan got the records he requested. The
judge appears to be taking the side of Friend's attorney Sowell who stated
“But we mooted it (the claim) when we gave him all
photo's courtesy of The State
“That reason (to sue) has evaporated now that they have
given you all the documents,” Toal said, quoting Sloan, who said that, once he
received the papers, his interest was only “academic.”
Carpenter told Toal a decision was necessary because
the foundation had denied other Freedom of Information requests and the case is
“of public importance.”
Toal countered, “What is the public importance in light
of the fact that the Freedom of Information Act has been complied with?”
Carpenter told Toal if the court didn’t rule, it would
be allowing public agencies to stonewall citizens seeking information.
“They didn’t give us the documents until after we sued
them. Should the court allow an entity to say, ‘No, we are not going to comply
with the Freedom of Information Act until you sue us?’’’
According to the State Newspaper Carpenter added, “It’s
not in keeping with the public policy of this state” to allow agencies to flout
the law until they are sued.
The foundation’s refusal to honor a Freedom of
Information request “cries out for a ruling by this court,” he said.
Responding to another Toal question, Carpenter said
“many, many tens of thousands of dollars” in attorney’s fees are at stake. Under
the law, if a plaintiff wins a Freedom of Information lawsuit, he or she is
entitled to attorney’s fees from the agency that violates the law.
The big question "Is the Friends of the Hunley, Inc. an
extension of an existing state agency, the Hunley Commission?" appears from the
attitude of the Chief Justice to be a difficult issue to resolve and a difficult
issue to prove leaving many people around the state either disappointed or
apathetic. Many of the black people around the state are naturally resentful
anyway over the money being spent uncontrollably. GWP
To the Post and
Courier and Charleston.net, My Thanks, appreciation and apologies.
My sincerest apologies go out to the Post and Courier and
Brian Hicks. In my haste to get out the newsletter, which takes me numerous
hours no matter what I do, apparently I did a partial re-write and in over
zealousness not to step on toes, I did anyway. Having lived in Charleston
all my life the Post and Courier has been a friend for 50 years. I know a
lot of the writers and staff and have relied on them for much of the information
I get. When the Fiends of the Hunley, Inc., Warren Lasch ( who gratefully
is now gone), and my good friend and fraternity brother Glenn McConnell suddenly
blacked me out from getting information. blocked my press privileges and no
longer invited me to press releases, the Post and Courier backed me up ,
although some of it was individual support and underground. My
support for truth and justice when it comes to politics and Lee Spence is well
known, but it has cost me,.... but I have never wavered. My hope is that
maybe one day we will have some deathbed confessions and repentance for the
wrongs that were done and history will rack itself into a truth alignment. You
never know. I have noticed that writers and reporters all over the world have
changed their stance and no longer attribute the finding of the Hunley to Clive
(the jive) Cussler, but instead take a more neutral stance Any fear or paranoia
are gone, there are no other retributions that FOTH can do that hasn't already
been done. We will see what happens with the "Freedom of Information" rights.
story appears to have been edited by you and is positioned over a graphic very
similar to the actual graphic that appeared with Hicks’ story in The Post and
informed that you have in the past had conversations with John Kerr, the
newspaper’s lead attorney, concerning the use of our copyright stories. In these
conversations, I am informed that conditions were accepted for the use of the
stories on your website. Two of the accepted conditions were that our stories
run on the site unedited and that the line “by (or with) permission of
The Post and Courier” line appear with it. I see that you have used the
permission line, however there has been no permission granted to edit the
concerns are that the story, “USS
Monitor and the CSS H L Hunley teams to collaborate on preservation”
is reprinted and is edited, and is
accompanied by a graphic that indicates, at least to some web visitors, that it
contains information from The Post and Courier, as does the story. As you are
aware, this graphic contains information that has not appeared in The Post and
Courier and, in fact, is in conflict with information we have published. To wit:
“Found: When: 1970 by E. Lee Spence”.
I assure you that I have no
quarrel whatsoever with your contention as to who found The Hunley. I only have
concerns because at least one visitor to your site has mistaken your graphic
information as content published by The Post and Courier.
If you will please remove the
edited story by Brian Hicks and replace it with an unedited version that is also
uninterrupted by added paragraphs and unassociated graphics, there will be no
need for further communications with Mr. Kerr. Also, there will be no need to
withdraw our permission for you to reprint copyright stories your site.
If you could also indicate by
some device that the graphic immediately below the story is unassociated with
the story, I will greatly appreciate it.
As a personal note, I found your
site to be very interesting and I very much enjoyed my visit to it.
You have my best wishes for your
The Post and Courier
134 Columbus St.
Hello Steve...Thanks for writing. I will try
fix this error immediately. Will send you the new link as soon as possible.
George W. Penington
username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Oklahoma City state: OK country: USA Remote Name: 220.127.116.11 Date: Monday November 28, 2005 Time: 11:16:51 AM
We have an ancestor that may be related to Hunley Sailor Joseph Ridgaway. Our
ancestors were Ridgeway's [also spelled Ridgway and Ridgaway from Virginia and
South Carolina. We are doing research to get it confirmed.
realname: Raj Kulkarni username: email@example.com city: Fredericksburg state: VA country: USA Remote Name: 18.104.22.168 Date: Saturday November 26, 2005 Time: 09:26:16 AM
I am trying to locate the book titled Valor in Gray for my adopted family of
Mr. Donald Doggett and his wife Ms. Joanne Doggett. I think I finally tracked it
down to your website. This is great. I would like to give this as Christmas
present to Mr. and Mrs. Doggett. Please let me know how I can buy this book.
Thanks so much. All the best. Raj
realname: Charles G. Hardin username: Consolidated-Industries@usa.net city: Fallbrook state: CA country: USA Remote Name: 22.214.171.124 Date: Monday November 21, 2005 Time: 05:44:43 AM
Lifetime member of the Lees of Virginia. Member of the Sons of Confederate
Veterans, American Civil War Society, and seeker of knowledge regarding the
activities and treasures of the Knights of the Golden Circle. I own a very rare
book on this subject entitled: "Jesse James Was One of His Names."
realname: greci username: greci city: New York state: NY country: USA Remote Name: 126.96.36.199 Date: Wednesday November 16, 2005 Time: 08:29:06 AM
Very good site! I like it! I just wanted to pass on a note to let you know
what a great job you have done with this site..Thanks!
realname: Grace Bowers username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Hurleyville state: NY country: USA Remote Name: 188.8.131.52 Date: Wednesday November 09, 2005 Time: 08:09:01 AM
Just heard about this incredible submarine. Never knew anything about it!
What a feat for those days and why was it kept secret all these years in history
books! Looking forward to reading more about it and the crew. They were so brave
to do such a think in those days.
realname: samantha username: city: rapid river state: mi country: USA Remote Name: 184.108.40.206 Date: Saturday November 05, 2005 Time: 09:04:29 AM
im doing a report on the hunley for school thats why i need this info
realname: Mark Hewlett username: city: Crowley state: tx country: USA Remote Name: 220.127.116.11 Date: Friday November 04, 2005 Time: 01:01:35 PM
I met a relative of Mr. Hundley who runs a hydraulics shop in Joshua, TX. He
told me about his great grandfather and that he changed his last name to Hundley
with a D so only his family would be remembered for his invention and not the
other Hunley's in America. (by the way, I am related to Harry S. Truman,
president of the USA !!! The Young family and Hewlett family are very proud of
Old Harry !!! It took a lot of guts to drop the atomic bomb !!! The man in
Joshua, TX looks just like Mr. Horace Hundley inventor. Thanks, Mark Hewlett,
realname: Justin username: city: Deerfield state: IL country: USA Remote Name: 18.104.22.168 Date: Wednesday November 02, 2005 Time: 04:13:40 PM
I need to find out about the USS Hunley for school or I'm gonna get a zero. I
am also interested in the HUnley
realname: haley username: city: cavespring state: ga country: USA Remote Name: 22.214.171.124 Date: Wednesday November 02, 2005 Time: 09:52:45 AM
the hunley seems really cool. Eight of my friend and I doing a pesintation of
the hunley for my schools livung timeline day. <3- HALEY *N* DEANA
realname: Oliver Neil Dixon username: email@example.com city: Unionville state: Ontario country: Canada Remote Name: 126.96.36.199 Date: Thursday October 27, 2005 Time: 08:10:03 PM
I saw a documentary about the Hunley and George E Dixon. I had an uncle name
George Dixon and another one named Ernest Dixon. They were sons of Calhoun (not
sure of the spelling) Dixon who settled at sometime in Trinidad (West Indies).
He came from either Ireland or Scotland.
realname: Justin Cheng username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Georgetown state: Penang country: Malaysia Remote Name: 188.8.131.52 Date: Friday October 21, 2005 Time: 03:26:03 AM
It is a great honor to learn more about THE HUNLEY. I've seen it in action
and have learn that it is the 1st ever undersea war machine to destroy the
realname: Michael R. King username: email@example.com city: Hermann state: MO country: USA Remote Name: 184.108.40.206 Date: Wednesday October 12, 2005 Time: 04:29:21 PM
I am interested in drawings, desire to build model, frame and hull drawings
would be appreciated. Thank you. Mike King phone 573-486-4506 fax 573-486-4507
informative site would like more info and pics of the discoverys that have
realname: d van konijnenburg username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: delft state: country: holland Remote Name: 220.127.116.11 Date: Saturday October 08, 2005 Time: 11:16:38 AM
I've seen the movie about the discovery and saving the Hunley on national
geographic I'm curious what happens after bringing it on land.
realname: Pam Durgan username: email@example.com city: Morrisonville state: NY country: USA Remote Name: 18.104.22.168 Date: Wednesday October 05, 2005 Time: 07:17:16 PM
I have been interested in Naval history for a number of years. I have to say
that the "submarine" division is my very favorite. Just finished watching a
documentary about "the Alligator". Very informative ,but "The Hunley" and her
crew really got me to respect the men who volunteer for sub duty and risk their
lives every day.
realname: Cheryl Buckler username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Sutherlin state: OR country: USA Remote Name: 22.214.171.124 Date: Tuesday October 04, 2005 Time: 02:07:06 PM
The most memorable part of the TV show was when the gold coin was recovered.
I also was pleased with the respect shown for the remains of the crew members; I
wish this was a more universal trait among people who dig up the past.
realname: jeff smith username: email@example.com city: florence state: al. country: USA Remote Name: 126.96.36.199 Date: Monday October 03, 2005 Time: 08:11:41 AM
An avid fan of Clive Cussler. Also an avid collector of civil war
realname: DOCTOR PAUL VAZQUEZ username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Phx state: Az country: USA Remote Name: 188.8.131.52 Date: Sunday October 02, 2005 Time: 09:13:07 PM
I recently saw somthing on tv about the Uss Alligator. I was mezmerized/I had
to see these civl war subs. They are cool/it is amazing the injinuity we had
back in those days with such limited imagination. I would like to learn more.
realname: Doug username: Dougieh79@hotmail.com city: Oshawa state: ont country: canada Remote Name: 184.108.40.206 Date: Wednesday September 28, 2005 Time: 04:20:50 AM
I was able to catch the t.v. show "Sea Hunters' when a team found the Hunley
and raised it from the water. I'm a huge military history buff and think the
Hunley story is an essential for any war buff. Your web site is very well laid
out and full of knowledge. Thanks
realname: Randy Gray username: email@example.com city: Dallas state: Or country: USA Remote Name: 220.127.116.11 Date: Saturday September 24, 2005 Time: 01:36:09 PM
My first visit to Hunley.com. Have always used Hunley.org. I like your
site.....very interesting and much more informative.
realname: Maryetta Rayca username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Kennett Square state: PA country: USA Remote Name: 18.104.22.168 Date: Friday September 23, 2005 Time: 03:11:26 PM
When I was visiting my son in Charleston, we visited the Hunley. Very
impressive. I had read the book by Clive Cussler and was amazed at the
preparation and preserevation taken to raise the Hunley. Amazing!
My ancestor Henry Beard died when the Hunley sunk the second time. I am very
proud of this fact and of my family heritage.
realname: dennis wiley username: email@example.com city: mobile state: al country: csa Remote Name: 22.214.171.124 Date: Wednesday September 14, 2005 Time: 01:35:57 AM
very nice article.we were all somewhat of a cav-romantic at his age.remember
your first 'WHITE BELT'? god bless.
realname: Steve Gandee username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Panama City state: Panama country: Panama Remote Name: 126.96.36.199 Date: Friday September 09, 2005 Time: 02:30:14 PM
I AM A SOUTH CAROLINIAN LIVING IN PANAMA. I WAS GOING TO TELL YOU ABOUT THE
SUB ON THE ISLAND OF PANAMA BUT I SEE SOMEONE BEAT ME TO IT. IN ANY CASE I CAN
SEND YOU SOME PICTURES IF YOU LIKE . REGARDS, STEVE GANDEE EVERGREEN AIRLINES
CALLE PALO SANTO ALBROOK PANAMA CITY PANAMA 128 LOCH NESS COURT ORANGEBURG, SC
realname: Eric Poach username: email@example.com city: Monroeville state: PA country: USA Remote Name: 188.8.131.52 Date: Friday September 09, 2005 Time: 01:11:23 PM
Had a chance to visit in July and I was greatly moved. I am looking forward
to the conclusions concerning what caused the vessel to sink, it seems current
evidence is pointing toward the vessel being swamped.
realname: Taylor Hadley username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Rock Hill state: SC country: USA Remote Name: 184.108.40.206 Date: Friday September 09, 2005 Time: 10:21:57 AM
To write a paper for school
realname: Fred Hicks username: Fred48@aol.com city: Hamilton state: NJ country: USA Remote Name: 220.127.116.11 Date: Wednesday September 07, 2005 Time: 10:06:30 AM
I think this is a great site and the information has been very helpful in
keeping up-to-date with The Hunley. I think the Hunley is a great treasure and
see been seen by everyone.
realname: alice walker young username: email@example.com city: Long Beach state: CA country: USA Remote Name: 18.104.22.168 Date: Wednesday August 31, 2005 Time: 06:06:02 AM
Recently, I saw the model of The Hunley at Ports 'O Call, in San Pedro, CA.
It came along with several (touring) tall ships. Does anyone know where this is
on display when it's not on tour? The scale-sized model looks to be made as
authentically as possible. I'd like to see it again someday.
realname: Linda R. Morgan username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Ethel state: LA country: USA Remote Name: 22.214.171.124 Date: Monday August 22, 2005 Time: 05:19:41 AM
I am so interested in the Hunley. Recently I visited the city of Charleston;
however, the tours are only available on weekends and I was there during the
week. Future plans are to return on the weekend and actually visit the Hunley.
realname: yager username: email@example.com city: fort plain state: n.y country: USA Remote Name: 126.96.36.199 Date: Sunday August 21, 2005 Time: 06:03:38 PM
I WAS LUCKY TO BE ABLE TO GO SEE THE HUNLEY JULY 2005 IT WAS THE MOST
INTERESING SITE TO SEE IF ANYONE IS IN CHARLESTON S.C ITS A MUST SEE YOU WILL
LOVE IT THE HISTORY ALONE IS WORTH IT
realname: Dan White username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Freeport state: Il. country: USA Remote Name: 188.8.131.52 Date: Friday August 19, 2005 Time: 07:40:47 AM
I just recently read the book, Raising of the Hunley, and was fascinated by
it. I did enjoy your web page. But, after the book, and your information, I do
have a question about the Hunley itself. I don't know if you answer questions on
line or not, but how did they attach the bomb to the vessel being destroyed, How
did it stick ? I find the models of the boat very intriguing, and may purchase
one in the near future. Thank-you Dan White
realname: stephen como username: email@example.com city: san antonio state: texas country: USA Remote Name: 184.108.40.206 Date: Thursday August 18, 2005 Time: 03:35:17 PM
i saw a show a few years ago about the discovery of the hundley and i have
always been interested in viewing the hundley when it is opened. i just saw a
show on the history channel called the "most" where they talked a little about
the hundley and it again raised my interest.
realname: Krista username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: swansea state: SC country: USA Remote Name: 220.127.116.11 Date: Sunday August 14, 2005 Time: 03:40:19 PM
I am facinated with the Hunley. I am in SC History this year and I look
forward to learning about the Hunley and everything there is to know. My mom
went to the tour in Charleston this weekend and she said that is is great so she
is taking me and my younger brother next weekend to see it. I truley am
facinated with the Hunley. Krista
I watched the Hunley, while I was on vacation several years ago, be pulled
out and made its final voyage. I find it very interesting to follow all the
discoveries that have been made.
realname: EroComix username: email@example.com city: New York state: NY country: USA Remote Name: 18.104.22.168 Date: Monday August 08, 2005 Time: 04:27:26 PM
WOW! I'll add your site to my bookmarks.
realname: Wanda Richard username: firstname.lastname@example.org city: Coral Springs state: FL country: USA Remote Name: 22.214.171.124 Date: Thursday August 04, 2005 Time: 07:03:49 AM
I love the whole Charleston area and the history of the place. It holds a
dear place in my heart. And the Hunley being there is just another part of that
realname: C. Grenfell username: email@example.com city: Whitby state: ON country: Canada Remote Name: 126.96.36.199 Date: Monday July 25, 2005 Time: 06:27:44 PM
I was recently in Charleston and wished to view the Hunley. Unfortunately,
the party I was with was unable to do so since any appointments to view this
artifact were only available on the weekends. We phoned the call centre located
in Arkansas, and were provided with information that differed from that
contained in the pamphlets obtained from local tourist locations. Perhaps the
Call Centre should be updated to ensure it provides information consistent with
the distribution materials available to the public. I hope to return to your
fine city next year and would truly like to view the Hunley since those who
served on it were of an impressive caliber. The fact that you only accept
appointments demonstrates a unique seriousness towards the viewing of a most
impressive vehicle of the CSA. Although Canadian, I can only express my
appreciation for the courage and commitment of the CSA during a most trying of
times. As you are well aware, Canadians supported the CSA, inspite of the
aggressive drafting procedures employed by the North for incorporating Canadians
into its force, during this time.
realname: Michael E. Allen username: Meadaa73@aol.com city: Middletown state: RI country: USA Remote Name: 188.8.131.52 Date: Sunday July 24, 2005 Time: 07:48:06 PM
Like many I am a Civil War/War Between the States enthusiast. My kin served
with the 11th Conn. Vol. Inf. and Artillery as well as the Thomas Legion
Walker Battalion CSA. The Hunley and especially the information about their
last hours is extremely interesting. The incredibly brave men that served
aboard this craft were not men that did not believe in their cause nor their
purpose. A difficult time in American history but a defining one in our
Nations growth. top
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